Hi,

My two fish are very unwell! Last night I noticed the black moor was lying at the bottom of his tank barely moving, flipping his fins and wriggling a bit every few seconds (this would mostly turn him upside down). The oranda isn't moving around much but is at least upright and moving.

The tank is 100L with a Fluval3 filter. The tank has been set up for several months now and the last 20% water change was about 10 days ago (with every water change I add 'Stress Coat' to the new water before I add it to the tank). The only fish in there are the oranda and moor. Over the last two months the tank has has a brown algae problem but it has become better with every water change and it doesn't grow back so quickly these days.

I suspect between the two fish there are a few different illnesses happening, but it is the moor I am most worried about. Other symptoms in the oranda: reddening at the base of the fins and tail, fin rot (not sure which type though), two weird white worm-looking things hanging out of one of his gills, and possibly too much slime coating. Other symptoms in the black moor: reddening on the fins and tail? (hard to tell), and possibly too much slime coating.

Last night I did about 75-80% water change. Before I did this the chemical readings were Nitrate 40, PH 7.5, Nitrite 0.25 and Ammonia 0. All the readings should presumably be less now since the water change. I also changed one of the filter sponges and then gave a dose of 'Anti Slime & Velvet'. This morning the black moor's gills are moving but nothing else really, just lying on its side at the bottom, worse than he was last night.

I am going to try and get some antibiotics for them today and some aquarium salt if they sell it. Can I use other household salt? I have a packet of Maldon Sea Salt (flaky crystals) which has no additives - would this do?

Any help would be much appreciated!!

Thank you!

Don't medicate before you know what it is, certainly doesn't sound like velvet so do another 30% water change and run carbon in the filter to get rid of that medication as a mix will itself be toxic to the fish. However in the future don't do water changes of more than 50% as that in itself adds to fish stress, and don't change filter sponges if you have readings above 0 for ammonia or nitrIte, you are chucking away useful bacteria
Can you post a photo urgently, try and get one of the affected gills, I am going to work now sorry v rushed hence terseness, but Fishy Fish or Suey2 may see it this morning.

Ok, thank you for the reply! The first photo I posted showing the head of the oranda close up shows the two white things hanging from his gill. The black moor doesn't seem to have anything on his gills. I have had the filter sponges in there (rinsed in old tank water during a water change) for several months now so I thought they may be getting a bit old and maybe one needed replacing, but I have kept the old one damp in a plastic bag...should I replace it?

I have just bought a packet of aquarium salts (Aqualibrium). Reccomended dosage for a 100l tank while undergoing treatment is 900g gradually over 3-4 days...rather a lot! I have just added one tablespoon and will add another tablespoon every few hours. Should I really add 900g of salt?!

I'll do a 30% water change now anyway and use carbon filter media to get rid of the anti slime theatment I just gave them...but what should I be treating them with? I am so confused!

I also bought 'Anti Internal Bacteria' and 'Anti Fungus and Finrot' in case I need to treat them for these.

Can anyone reccomend a type of antibiotic to buy online? My local shop doesn't have any.

bump
(at work)

I'm no expert in what this would appear to be, but that could be gill flukes Laboured breathing, reddening, fish lying around etc is he gulping at all?

The white things hanging out of the gill look like flukes, given pics I've looked at on google. Mostly they are small, 2mm of so and are hidden under the gill plate so they are hard to spot, but some species are longer.

This is going to sound quite squeamish, but is it possible for you to take a closer look at all? If you could hold him in a wet cloth so as to not disturb the slime coating and lift the gill cover (if you can) bit hard with these types I know. Can you see what would look like eyes on the end of the white bits, magnifying glass perhaps? A two person job I'm sure and I understand they can be treated but as with all parasites they can be tricky. As for meds, I'm not sure which so hoping someone with experience of these can assist too but I'll have a quick reccy now to see if anything jumps out.

I wouldn't suggest you change the foam filters. These should be good for years until you need to do so and that won't assist with the problem really.

Hi - I notice you have posted this on another site and have had some advice from them and have now added salt to the tank so I wouldn't advise adding any meds now you have salt in the water, some will react with the salt (I seem to recall myxazin and sterazin might, can't remember exactly and will try and find thread in question). The salt may do the trick anyway

Flukes aren't visible to the naked eye as far as I can find out so I doubt it is that, more likely to be slime or a fungal infection on a small wound perhaps

I notice no one on the other forum asked about diet - what are you feeding them, how much and how often? The one lying on its side could have dietary issues so would be wise to look at that too. How are their poos? Nice thing to have to investigate but very useful nonetheless

How long has this been going on? Is is overnight-sudden or has it gradually crept up on you? I'm not being critical, just trying to get the full pic

As the other forum has mentioned - you need to up your maintenance to 25% water changes per week to keep on top of nitrate - nitrite should be nil so any trace of that and you have a problem - check all your filters are running freely, pipes are clean etc.

HTH

EDIT - nitrite lowers the blood's ability to carry oxygen which could explain the laboured breathing.

Another thought - the white spots on the oranda's pectoral fins could be breeding spots? The ones on my males look very raised and almost like little fungus growths sometimes

Ok seems it's not flukes tbh. The other site I was looking at is wrong - grrr. All the other sources tonight, as Suey has already posted, indicate flukes can only be confirmed by taking scrapings and testing under a microscope. Thats good news though Those white blobs could just be wen growths, given other pics.

Can only agree, looks like water parameter readings then which should be easy to resolve with good tank husbandry. Weekly gravel hoovers, weekly water changes, weekly water testing to ensure all is well in the tank. May be easier to resolve than first thought

I'm feeding them mostly Tetra Goldfish flakes twice a day (a small pinch), and very occasionally Tetra Goldfish Granules or sometimes Tetra Brine Shrimps in Jelly. Every few weeks I feed them two squashed up peas.

I'm not sure how their poos are, they don't have any at the moment as they're not feeding. In the past I have sometimes noticed they can be 'hollow', like a tube.

This has come on quite suddenly. The oranda usually sits or swims around the bottom of the tank but is fairly active and will swim around the tank around at the feeding times of day and would eat fine, and the black moor has always been fine, active and normal. I did notice the black moor sitting around at the bottom of the tank like the oranda, on Sunday/Monday and neither were very hungry, and then on Tuesday night the moor was on its side only moving every couple of minutes and neither of the fish were moving around the tank or eating. So it has all happened quite quickly!