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Mr_A_83 Mr_A_83
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  • Posted on: 21/4/2012 15:25
Re: Feeding Garlic #51
Just given my Angel fish a small chunk of Banana and wow... It's like it has never been fed before!
It feeds well normally, just never over enthusiastic like this. My Cory's had a little look and tuft over, and decided no as it is outside there normal feeding time. May try again in a few days at there feeding time when they are awake. lol.

What things do cory's like as supplemental outside of bloodworm and catfish pellets?
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Miss Dorsal Miss Dorsal
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 1:28
Re: Feeding Garlic #52
Does soaking food in garlic solution kill internal infection? In my experience, no but officially speak?

On a side note Seachem are making flakes that contain all sorts of wonderful things, garlic included.
suey2 suey2
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 12:24
Re: Feeding Garlic #53
Garlic is one of those things that raises quite a lot of debate It seems relatively widely accepted as an appetite stimulant so that would explain the inclusion of it in various brands of food.

It contains a chemical called allicin which can kill parasites but my understanding of it is that you'd need considerably more of it to make a dent on any parasites than you'd get from the average bulb of garlic. I could be wrong of course! There doesn't seem to be much agreement within the fishkeeping community that would point to it being 100% effective, some people use it, others think it's rubbish, I'd guess that somewhere in the middle is likely. it might help with some things, won't with others, and is likely to depend on the individual circumstances of the situation in question
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Fishlady Fishlady
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 13:58
Re: Feeding Garlic #54
There's some evidence that garlic in the diet (regularly) can improve immune response which could theoretically provide some resistance to infection with parasites and disease, but as far as I know there is no evidence of it being an effective treatment for established infection. I believe to improve immunity quite a lot would need to be eaten daily and in raw form and if other factors are causing compromise it may not be effective in such circumstances.
Miss Dorsal Miss Dorsal
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 20:14
Re: Feeding Garlic #55
It certainly didn't cure my fish and I used it repeatedly for ages, both adding to the food and making "garlic water" to add to the tank. Luckily I took him to the vet and got proper meds but I believe if I had of continued using the garlic treatment, he would be dead now. I, under no uncertain terms, was told it will kill parasites but it won't and I found that out the hard way. I'd say it's probably a good preventative if the fish is already healthy.

Another thing I was told is you have to be careful because it can anesthetize the fish. The person in question used a "garlic water" treatment, doubled the dose and the fish tilted. She then had to put green tea in her tank for days to try and wake him with the caffeine. He did come round eventually but died, aged 13, a couple of months later from an infection apparently caused by explosions being carried out near the persons house causing stress to the fish.
Fishlady Fishlady
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 21:56
Re: Feeding Garlic #56
Without wanting to sound rude, it seems that this person hasn't a clue what they're doing to be honest. Most fish diseases are a result of any or a combination of incorrect accommodation, poor water quality, incorrect water parameters, inappropriate stock levels. Get those right and the majority of fish will live long and healthy lives. Genetic defects in some fish contribute to general ill health, but even in those cases, the effects of the bad hand they've been dealt can be minimised by good husbandry. When infection does strike, proper meds are the best bet especially where simpler remedies like salt (for certain very specific conditions only) are not working.
Violet Violet
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 22:17
Re: Feeding Garlic #57
Personally, I think I have to agree with Fishlady on this.

Garlic whilst being an appetite stimulant (and proven to be so) so can be found in food. Not to be used for fish infections though. There are better, far more effective and trusted meds for that, such as Waterlife and Esha.

As for Green Tea - nothing that some good daily water changes wouldn't fix. I've seen US sites referring to this but then again, they still think that 60 litres is OK for 2 fancies and recommend bare bottom tanks and the like. Green tea on a US site I was just looking at was recommended for nitrate poisoning. If fish are in a suitably sized thank with external filtration and the adequate amount of water changes - nitrate poisoning does not happen.

I think fish care has moved on a little since then. US sites are known to be rather poor on advice standards when compared to the UK.

I'm not aware of nearby explosions that lead to infections. In reality, it's far more likely to be an unsuitably sized tank and poor water quality lead to infection. Would be interesting to have known this persons tank size, stocking and water quality results for pH, GH, ammonia, nitrite and nitrate

I think the fact his fish died and there were explosions nearby - well, he added 2 and 2 together and got 5, mistakingly thinking that the explosions were the cause of the infection.
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Asumel Asumel
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 22:43
Re: Feeding Garlic #58
Quote:

Miss Dorsal wrote:
It certainly didn't cure my fish and I used it repeatedly for ages, both adding to the food and making "garlic water" to add to the tank. Luckily I took him to the vet and got proper meds but I believe if I had of continued using the garlic treatment, he would be dead now. I, under no uncertain terms, was told it will kill parasites but it won't and I found that out the hard way. I'd say it's probably a good preventative if the fish is already healthy.

Another thing I was told is you have to be careful because it can anesthetize the fish. The person in question used a "garlic water" treatment, doubled the dose and the fish tilted. She then had to put green tea in her tank for days to try and wake him with the caffeine. He did come round eventually but died, aged 13, a couple of months later from an infection apparently caused by explosions being carried out near the persons house causing stress to the fish.

I think this is one of those times where you don't believe everything you hear on the internet.
While garlic may or may not benefit the fish in any way. I have seen a few papers where a small amount of garlic has aided in growth, colour and anti-bacterial agent. these are all times when they are used as a feed supplement but would not cure. the results are very varied from fish to fish species and paper to paper that it is hard to get a adequate conclusion. but from what I can gather from a quick skim of the current literature is that the difference between nothing, the amount which benefits and the amount that have no effect ( but is greater than the beneficial amount) is so small that its easy to overdose and you are just adding garlic to feed with no antibacterial benefit.
However there is strong results when it comes to enhancing feeding rates and growth.
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finnipper finnipper
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 22:54
Re: Feeding Garlic #59
The aquarium use of garlic is meant to appeal to the people who think natural is best. It is aimed at fish keepers who prefer new age medicines, herbalism, homeopathy ect. Apart from being a mild appetite stimulant, which it does by mimicking the effects of insulin it has little other use in fish keeping.
If it is used as a remedy for things like white spot, so much is required to have an effect that the fish would be living in garlic soup:

Some of the chemicals found in garlic do kill the protozoa at very high doses. When tested it took 570mg/l of garlic extract to kill the parasite totally (a clove of garlic typically contains about 4mg of the active ingredient allicin, meaning that 142 cloves of garlic per litre of water would be required as an effective white spot therapy) while it only took 0.25 mg/l of malachite green to do the same.

If you want to treat yourself with these crackpot remedies that's your choice. But when an animal in your care falls ill you are duty bound to provide the most effective proven treatment.
Violet Violet
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  • Posted on: 2/11/2013 23:08
Re: Feeding Garlic #60
@ Asumel - yup, more food will trigger faster growth (not that I'm suggesting overfeeding in any way - another topic altogether!)

@ Finnipper - couldn't agree more. ?5 for a bottle of Esha Exit for Ich. No garlic in site and uber effective.

@ Miss D. Who exactly is telling you all this? Is it a UK or US keeper? I'm concerned for you and your fish given the last few posts. I hope FK can try and address some of this 'out there' really 'odd' advice for you. So much naff info on the internet I know. FK though have sound UK long term keepers with lot's of experience between us.
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