so just to confirm? LR its better to buy from someone who has had it running in their tank already? I read somewhere its better to buy from lfs as you get the added bonus of hitch-hikers? I think i've found a suitable tank/setup
its a Jewel Rio 180 Aquarium - 180litres with cabinet
101x41x50cm (the lights are double marine tubes)
this has its own internal sponges and filter which can be removed.
it also has Eheim 2227 Professional External Breathing Filter TMC V2 Skimmer 400 this fits on the side of the tank or in the sump
what do you guys think? is this suitable to start up with?
thanks for describing what a tank buster is suey2! appreciated the advice also.
are we still suggesting around 25kg LR for the tank above? cheers guys. also what other items do you suggest i get for the above setup?
You should get hitchikers whether you buy from a LFS OR from someone's estabilshed tank, it doesn't really matter - as long as the rock has been well looked after, there will be hitchikers on it! I got plenty on mine, maybe Howard was trying to say that if you buy second hand LR from an established tank, then the hitchikers will in turn be well established and have grown to a larger size than they would be in LFS rock, where you might not see some of the hitchikers for months because they are so tiny to begin with (generally it is the really small bits that survive the long journey in the porous rock) but in the long run you will have the same thing.
Still, I would be careful about buying second hand rock. Make sure you see it and make sure it's nice and light and isn't overun with nasties such as Aiptasia. Light rock is porous rock, and the more porous the more life it can support, and the easier it is for nitrate eating bacteria to form. Indonesian rock is generally very good stuff, that is what I bought for my tank.
That setup sounds good, if it comes with a sump? Is all that in for ?200? That's a bargain, the filter is worth ?150 alone, but you won't need it, in fact, don't use it at all it will not help if you are going down the Berlin route, just sell it on.
25KG would be a good starting point, you can add more as you go if you need to.
The typical rule of thumb for the Berlin method is 1 to 2 lb per U.S. gallon. That equates to 0.45Kg to 0.9Kg of Live Rock per 4 litres, so for a 180 litre tank you want to be looking at:
180/4 = 45 45 * 0.45 = 20.25Kg 45 * 0.9 = 40.5Kg
That's what the books say is needed for sucessful nitrate removal in the Berlin method, although I did find this passage:
"Although an old rule of thumb states that 1-2 lbs of live rock is required per gallon of tank size, the wide range of available rock makes the rule pretty inaccurate. It is suggested that a visual method be used, consuming approximately 1/3rd of the tank volume with rock - leaving 2/3rd of the volume in open water. You should probably only use the rule of thumb as a sanity check. For instance, 10 lbs of the best rock would be too little for a 75 gallon tank, no matter how good the rock is. Likewise, 300 lbs would be overkill." http://fins.actwin.com/reefkeepers/reefkeeper1.html
What i was trying to say is that if you buy LR from someone breaking down their system , you will more than likely get corals attached ( mushrooms , xenia , that sort of thing ).
In terms of mobile hitchhikers though , remember that the shop stuff has come from the ocean thousands of miles away, hitchhikers will die off , and while the rock may be cured , the HH population will be fairly low.
Rock that has been in someones tank for years however will be full of life and you will have minimal die off if you transfer it quickly.
As EG says though , watch out for aiptasia and majano , they spread like wildfire and are difficult to eradicate , but don't let a few put you off , just zap them before you put the rock in your tank.
Keep your friends close , but your anemones closer ....
hi the setup below doesnt have a sump. would i be able to use the filter for a while until i convert to sump etc. or would it be feasible to get said setup and sell the filter for as much as i can then go the sump way?
do any of you have any links on a good berlin setup thanks.
Yes you should be able to get a sump for around that. If you are handy then you could make your own from scratch, or just get a second hand tank and silicone dividers in palce, or better still buy a second hand sump. You will need to drill the tank though, so it's not for the faint hearted...
unfortunately the guy sold that setup before i could get up to collect it. gutted. i think that would've been a nice start. Any one know of any decent sites i could get a second hand empty setup? or is it just aquarist-classifieds?