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Jaywickrob Jaywickrob
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 14:21
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #21
There has been studies on Nitrate levels and how they effect Goldfish. It is generally accepted, or at least seems to be, that Nitrate of up to 50ppm is harmless to Goldfish.
I try to keep my tanks as low as possible, usually under 10ppm because even at low levels Nitrate is apparently immune suppressive.
As I understand it, Nitrate can also cause inflamation of the air sacs effecting the fishes ability to move air between the sacs & the gut, causing imbalance.

Jay
"Treatment when the treatment is worse than the disease kills fish"
suey2 suey2
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 14:28
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #22
Just found what I was on about re nitrates; there are some links from me on the following thread plus evidence from Cathie

http://www.fishkeeping.co.uk/modules/ ... t_id=76976#forumpost76976

And an explanation from LHG in this one:

http://www.fishkeeping.co.uk/modules/ ... id=141082#forumpost141082

The singletail in my avatar was super-sensitive to nitrates, he was like a miner's canary for letting me know if things were creeping up! Didn't need to get very high and he developed red veins in all his fins.
It's Not Just A Fish
Miss Pennyapple Miss Pennyapple
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 17:35
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #23
I'm not happy I have to admit with the nitrate level in the tank. It used to be 10-20 when there were 2 fish in there. The plants have thinned out recently due to salt treatment (although I didn't lose any plants at all!) and the fish of course helping themselves to a snack or two! So I think I will order some more plants asap.

Luckily, none of the fish have buoyancy issues. My fantail used to, but since I started feeding Hikari, which claims to aid digestion thus avoiding swimbladder gas, he hasn't floated at all. Very pleased with this improvment I have to say.

A larger tank will be purchased as soon as possible, as this is really what is needed to sort the Nitrate problem.
Squish Squish
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 18:07
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #24
Hi Laura,

You could also get some moss balls in there as they are good at reducing nitrate and, in my opinion, look very pretty in tanks too. Plus the goldies will enjoy eating them. Several of mine aren't 'balls' anymore

Lisa x
rachyw82 rachyw82
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 18:36
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #25
Hiya,

I think my panda may be sensitive to nitrate as when she went through her floaty phase, the nitrate was above 10. That is the only correlation I found, but even that wasn't always true.

Just a quick one on Waterlife Sterazin, I went to Dobbies today (I know you shop there Miss P) and they had quite a good sale in the aquatic section. I got a bottle of Aqua Plus for ?5 (usually about ?8) and also some Sterazin (just in case I ever have fluke problems) reduced from over ?8 down to ?3, because the newer bottles dated 09/14 had arrived, and the bottle I purchased is dated 09/12, so try Dobbies if you intend to try Sterazin.

Hope your fishies are doing ok.
fredrick_more fredrick_more
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 20:23
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #26
Hi,

Firstly is it possible to get someone (idealy some at a aquatic shop or koi dealer) to do a skin scape? If do then i suggest you ask them.

Doing a successful skin scrape is not easy, to begin you need the equipment (a good mircoscope, glass slides, saline soloution and some times a dye depending what your looking for).

Then its a matter of doing the scrape, which needs to be a firm but solid and constante scrape on the fish (going with the scales), then a little saline soloution and then pressing the slide agaisnt another, which is hard as you need to aviod air being caught or it will be very hard to find stuff.

And actual trying to find something is extremely different, some will look like air, some air will look like parasites, dirt will do as well and some parasites move very very quickly.

Also you will always find something on scrape on all fish but determining whether its in dangerous level depends on the parasite and how many you find.

Its quite a few years since ive done a scrape so i might of missed or got a few bits wrong buts roughly about right
Miss Pennyapple Miss Pennyapple
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 23:40
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #27
Thanks Frederick. Yes, this was another of my concerns actually. Would I even know what I was looking for if I did do a scrape? Probably not. Knowing what you should be looking for wouldn't be easy. I can imagine I might see all sorts of things that look like bugs which actually aren't! And I've read too that fish do have some low numbers of parasites that don't cause any problems, and seeing a few under the microscope doesn't mean the fish needs treatment.

I think I will try the Droncit again since it was very effective before, but add another dose to try and make sure all the flukes are gone. Then see where we are at. At least I know that Droncit is fish, filter and plants friendly and shouldn't cause any problems.

On another topic, the fish might be getting that new tank sooner than I (and they!) thought.......! Just to clarify, larger volume of water means more dilution of Nitrates, right?!!
cathie cathie
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 23:54
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #28
Quote:

Just to clarify, larger volume of water means more dilution of Nitrates, right?!!


yup

Sorry if you have already said this, what is your tap water nitrate?
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Violet Violet
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  • Posted on: 16/1/2010 23:59
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #29
Yup, thats good news MPA. More water will dilute the nitrate readings and enable you hopefully, to get back to a weekly water change hopefully. Whats your tap water nitrate btw?

I'd still recommend levels are lower than 20ppm to avoid any future probs - see the link from LHG - posted from Suey.

Apologies that I didn't know your current set up/accomodation issues nor that you were already planning to upgrade when I mentioned the overstocking problem. Helps if you fill your profile in though to comment on stuff like this to avoid any future misunderstandings

Note your pH from the tap and tank is still the same, so can be ruled out too Looks like scrapes then - this would freak me a bit TBH, so good luck. Only start the Droncit if you have enough to complete the course though, like C said.

Edit// post clashed with Cathie
Please fill in your personal profile if you are posti
Miss Pennyapple Miss Pennyapple
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  • Posted on: 17/1/2010 0:10
Re: Droncit Vs Flukes! #30
Thanks guys, it's nice to have support again after spending so long without a forum! :D

Was talking to the other half tonight about the tank issue and moving to a bigger flat etc, and he said that if I need to get a bigger tank now to keep the fish healthy then I should just do that. This is all assuming of course my landlady lets me get a bigger tank!! She's been great about the 165L so hoping she'll be fine about the next size up! It might be months before we can find somewhere to move to that's right and allows us to have the fish (renting is a pain!) so the fish might as well have their new home asap! Exciting!

Yeah, I agree about the Droncit and completing the course with the right dosage so will order some more Droncit tomorrow (expensive stuff by the way, but worth it!) and try a 2nd treatment regime.

I've tested the nitrate in my tap water before, a few months back, and it's 0. I thought it was pretty lucky that my tap ph is 7.2!