I'm sorry haven't been on here for a while but working 7 days (live out nanny/carer) odd hours and my crafts i do, doesn't allow for to much of anything else haha but i love the children i work with so not complaining.

What i need is a little advice on my goldies....After i have fed my fish they always seem to float on their sides and struggle a little with swimming. Over the last few months have tried smaller feeds, feeding every other day (this seems to stop the prob on day not fed but they are then going barmy cos they aint been fed) soaking food first and even bought a different type of food but nothing seems to help. They have plenty of room in their tank 3 fancies in a 260 litre tank. Water tests are fine all 0 bar nitrate which is 40 but then our tap water is that. There is something i am missing to help them, can anyone help.

Happy new year to you all
Bead x

Hi B, no need to apologise for not having been around for a while Sounds to me like you might have a couple of problems here though Nitrate of over 40 can cause buoyancy issues as it affects the way the blood vessels dilate and thus affects the way the swimbladder operates. High nitrate can also cause digestion problems apparently, I've copied this next bit from Jaywickrob on PFK

"As I understand it..
There have been studies carried out to examine the effects of Nitrate on Goldfish.
One of these studies suggests that when NitrATE is injested with food it is converted to NitrITE by bacteria in the gut which is then absorbed into the bloodstream.
NitrITE, as we know, is toxic because it inhibits the ability to process Oxygen, effectively suffocating the fish.
When NitrATE is injested with food the resulting NitrITE builds up in the bloodstream over a long period of time. The fish will become listless and suffer from lack of oxygen at the extremities and possibly also to vital organs."

Longhairedgit, one of our members, also had this to say about nitrate in relation to a floaty fancy goldie

Quote:

Which nitrate testing kit are you using? You can get filters which remove nitrate so it might be worth looking into one of those. I've got these ones:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NITRATE-FILTER- ... _Fish&hash=item255e8df11b

Only thing with those is that they reduce PH so you need to be aware of that and find a way to raise it again before adding the water to the tank. I've got some ocean rock to experiment with but I've not done so as yet - will post when (don't hold your breath!) I do

On the diet front, what food/brand are you feeding, how often and how much? Floatyness is, IME, almost always a result of something in the diet disagreeing with the fish.

Try fasting for 48 hours to let the guts calm down a bit, if they are irritated they will be producing more gas so sometimes need a period of fasting to allow any irritation/inflammation to die down. If any bits of the fish are poking out of the water you can smear vaseline on them to keep them from drying out. Also keep an eye on lights if you have them in case they get a bit overheated when stuck at the top of the water

HTH - let us know what they're eating at the mo and we should be able to find out if this is what' causing the problems

Hi Suey thanx for reply. The test kit i use is the one that is recommended on here (sorry cant remember name) the food i use is tetra fin growth something (sorry forgot name again haha only just been out to see what it was called recommended by LFS). I have tried alsorts of different ways of feeding from smal amounts 2 or 3 times a day to only feeding them every third day, the feeding everyother day seems to allow them to 'get over' the floaty prob. But then they act like piranas the next day cos they are starving haha typical goldies.

I will go and get a nitrate remover thingy this week somtime and re test my tap water (just to make sure it is that high) they seem so happy any other time so think it is to do with food (they dont seem to be growing as quick as I thought they would). Maybe I will invest in some frozen peas do you think they would help?

Thanx

Bead x x

It does sound food related - try switching to a different brand like Tetra Gold Japan and see if that makes a difference Do you soak the food before they get it? If it is absorbing water and swelling up in the gut it could be pressing on the swimbladder so best to soak it first.

Try some alternative foods too such as algae wafers, I use the Ocean Nutrition ones with added spirulina. Break them up and soak them really well, about 20 minutes until they go soft and swell up. You could also try some Nutrafin Max algae and garlic tablets, again break up and soak but not for as long.

Peas are goldie laxatives so don't go giving them peas every day Defrost, shell, chop/squish and feed. Pea poos are a lovely dayglo green so you'll know if they've come through!

I give mine their dry (soaked) rations in the morning and then they have frozen (defrosted) food or veg in the evenings. They also don't get fed on a Monday to let them clear out (several pairs of woeful eyes are watching me at the mo )

Bear in mind that the nitrate filter I posted the link to will reduce PH so you'll need to experiment a bit to make sure the PH remains stable in the tank

Hi again, They are having the tetrafin gold japan mixed in with the Tetra fin gold growth (until growth one is gone, not much left now) yes i do soak it for at least 20 to 30 mins, i started doing that as some of the food was floating and the greedy little things gulped down loads of air with it. I will go and get some of the wafers you recommend hopefully tomorrow.

I have given peas to them today and yes de-frosted, shelled and squished they absolutely went mad for it. but will only give on rare occasions if they are a laxative to them (they make enough mess as it is. Be interesting to see dayglo green poo in the tank hahaha.

I have given their tank a good clean out today as had tested the water and nitRate had gone up again to about 60ppm, so did about a 45% water change, good gravel clean and checked filter.... then I remembered I had added my external filter (fluval 405 an early xmas pressie to them :)) around about 8 to 9 weeks ago had left in the old filters a fluval U3 and a U4 so to give the bacteria time to mature in new filter, unfortunately the U3 stopped working for some reason and I removed it probably at about week 4 to 5 could this have contributed to the nitRate spike? I know i had the problem of side swimming fish before but wondered if this didn't help matters. I have now planned to do a 30% water change everyother day for the next week and see if it helps the nitRates to lower. I also retested the tap water and suprisingly it is now only 10ppm where as a yearish ago it was up by the 40ppm can this happen???????????? I didn't think it did!!!!

What frozen food do you feed them? I looked at frozen the last time i was at the shop and it all seemed geared towards tropical fish. also decided to leave the nitrate remover until after I have done water changes as if that resolves the problem I wont need to get one.

Thanx for your help Suey, i hate to think i might lose my little fishy babies cos of this food/nitRate prob.

Ooh - 60ppm of nitrate won't have been making them feel too good - good news that you found out about that one Tap water nitrate can rise and fall, ours is higher after heavy rainfall for example. From my understanding of these things it also depends on what the rain is running through once it lands on the earth and makes its way to the resevoir. Farmland can apparently increase nitrate in the water supply due to the fertilisers etc.

A few water changes should see you right though, especially now you've done a larger one to reduce things now I don't think the broken filter would have contributed much to the problem, nitrate is the end product of the nitrogen cycle so high nitrate does at least mean the rest of it is working properly.

If it's any comfort, I have problems with nitrate sneaking up sometimes and I've been doing some frequent water changes as well recently as some of mine were looking a bit fed up. They seem to be looking a bit chirpier tonight though so I'm sure yours will perk up too

As for frozen food, I give mine bloodworm, brineshrimp, garlic brineshrimp (really!) and sometimes mysis. I stopped giving them daphnia, they have got to quite a size now and they seem to prefer larger bits of food. Daphnia is very good for them though. Goldies are omnivores, they'll eat a wide range of foods. They are a form of carp so pretty much anything goes! I've recently tried mine on Nutrafin Max bottom feeder sinking food tablets - these have earthworm meal in them and after a bit of a soak have proved popular. I've also bought them some Nutrafin Max 'pleco logs' but they are rather larger than I was expecting so I haven't tried those yet!

Hi Suey. wow the change in them this morning is great they are very lively again so nitrate wasn't helping them at all. Once I have finished my cuppa (just got back from work) they are getting another water change and then i am going to go buy some frozen foods for them.

Now i know tap water levels can vary i am going to start to test that on a regular basis too so I can keep an eye on it.

Thank you for your help in sorting this matter as I no longer trust what the fish shops say as quite often it BS.I know if i come on here i am going to get honest and reliable answers that benefit the fish and not the shop keepers pockets.

Glad they're looking better Thankfully most things can be traced to a problem in the water so at least that can be rectified quite easily FX they carry on doing well for you

What volume of feed should be fed per size of goldfish?

I often wonder if I'm feeding too much or too little.

They get some flakes / spirulina or daphnia in the morning, brine shrimp gel or bloodworm gel in the evening, but how much should they get, if there's a way of calculating it?

Hello again, still having probs with my goldies. I have put it down to dried food now. For the last few days I have given them a mixture of frozen foods and have not had any 'floaty problems' until I gave them some soaked dried food, I soaked it for over 20 mins before feeding it to them and now they are on their sides and upside down .
Would the goldfish get all the nutrtion they need from the mixture of frozen I give them (mix is blood worm, daphnia, chopped mysis, brine shrimp and brine shrimp with spirinula) not all at once but chopped and changed each day. If not can i get a frozen food that will give them all they need? what is it called.

I have got the nitrAtes under control, still having problems with brown algae tho (on going for a while), have tried changing light times (splitting) but hasn't help much, so gonna get water tested for phosphrate (spl) this week as I read somewhere that could be the cause.

This is beginning to annoy me now as I have tried my best to keep the fish tank as healthy as possible but seem to be always running into brick walls.